I don't fit either category, but from talking to my Sister (lt. Col Air Force) and my Brother in Law (Lt. Col. Air Force) both active duty, if you miss two promotion cycles (I think 2 years per cycle or so) then you are encourage to move on.
I thought it was 3 promotion cycles, but I could be wrong (or it could have changed - I'm a couple of decades out of date.
Once you've missed two (or three) cycles, you have the option of retiring, or reverting to your highest enlisted rank. Depending on how close you are to your 'twenty' it might be worth it to revert and sweat out a couple of years, but it is NOT fun. There are slightly different rules for enlisted, but the general thrust is the same (except that, obviously, there is no option to revert to a lower rank and stay in - once an enlisted has missed the requisite promotions, they're just discharged).
Now, retirement is a different story. The standard is you can retire at twenty years of active duty and collect a pension or stay in, but once you reach thirty years, it requires special dispensation to stay in. General MacArthur got it. Colonel Smith won't. On occasion, officers with fewer years (15 is common) are given the option to retire with a pension, but this is the exception, rather than the rule.
While you didn't ask, I'll throw this in as well, your pension (either when you retire, or when you reach 65, if you didn't make your twenty) is based on your highest permanent rank AND the number of years your served. So the longer you stay in, the bigger the pension. On the other hand, our supposed Captain, who missed his promotion cycles and reverted to Staff Sgt, will automatically get promoted BACK to Capt when he retires (resulting in a situation where his/her pension is actually more than his/her current pay).
Hope this helped. (Neither vet nor military expert myself, but a lot of family in the service, and I've seen multiple people go through this process.)
Generally I found that the ones who were passed over for promotion twice are given the hint that its time to move on, followed by forced relocation out of the command structure of your current general. This does give you one more shot at getting it right but after that they more or less write you the letter themselves.
My Uncle's career stalled this way after making it to brigadier general in the air force. He had a divorce that got ugly and the wife circuit got word and that just about killed his chance at promotion. Officer wives have a great deal of influence over the career of higher ranking officers.
He was shuffled off three times to new command areas and in the end the base medical officer wrote a letter stating his health was too diminished to command. Which is a messy forced retirement.
One item I skipped over in my reply that sorta ties in here, is that this does apply to all officer ranks, not just captains. However, 'captain' is by far the most common rank where this occurs. Promotion up to that rank is fairly automatic (keep your nose clean, get your job done), but when they're promoting to major, they're starting to scrutinize the candidate more closely, looking at who's got the best potential.
Once you make major, there's another big hump between 'colonel' and 'general'. Promotion to general more or less requires connections, skill at office politics, etc. Simply being good at your job is no longer enough.
Being competent at your job has sadly never been the only point for being retained in the military.
There are some people who are technical masters at their job, but aren't great leaders. In the US Army and US Marines, that's almost always a career killer.
(Great leader as defined by some vague and unknowable list of requirements in peace time. Even more vague in a shooting war)
that if you failed to make Captain, you were screwing the General's daughter, and if you failed to make 1st Lt, you were screwing his son. (Assume a male officer). This was, of course, a joke, but perhaps a fairly accurate rendition of how easy/automatic the first two promotions are. Beyond that, you don't actually get promoted, you get put "on the list" for promotion and wait for everyone ahead of you to get promoted, separate, or die.
However 1). Availability of promotion may vary by era and personnel needs 2). As of the time I was in (20 years ago, between Vietnam & the War on Terror) you could not get to half-pay retirement (20 years) if you go in as a 2nd Lt, and never get promoted beyond Captain. Some Captains retired, but they had prior enlisted time. I met two Navy Lieutenants (O-3, like an AF Captain) who were involuntarilly separated without getting retirement for failure to be promoted.
A Major/O-4 can get all the way to 20 years without further promotion, but not to 30. I think a Lt. Col can get 30 years in.
Officer promotions follow a "time-in-service flow and promotion opportunity rates for "in the zone" promotion" (zone is simply an amount of time from their last promotion to their current eligibility).
Two flubs and you're either retired or required to separate. This could be kinda ugly if you've got 18 years in.
Now, an officer who is looking at a promotion to Major to Colonel, can attempt an early (or below-the-zone) promotion. Most of them don't do that unless they have a 100% lock on the requirements, (schooling, level/type of assignments, fitness reports) because if you *don't* get that promotion below the zone, it counts as one of your two strikes.
If you don't get promoted your first go around "in the zone", you slide into the "above the zone" the selection rate is *very* low (like 3%).
One of the real killers of this system is the fitness report. I've seen officers who just didn't get along with their superior officers get their careers hammered by the stroke of a pen. And I've seen dirt bags glow on paper.
NCOs staying in are a little different. There's a minimum rank that you have to be to be allowed to stay in for 20 years, that that is E6 (Staff Sergeant in the Army and Marines, Technical Sergeant in the Air Force and one of those frickin' Petty Officer ranks in the Navy/Coast Guard ((sorry, even after all this time being in the service and being interested in military, I still haven't figured out the naval ranks)). In theory, you could be promoted to E6 in the first eight years of your career and never get another promotion.
Once you hit E6, it becomes a case of how many years you can stay in before they muster you out. As an E6, you can stay for roughly 23 years.
NCOs have similar promotion requirements - schools, positions and fitness reports, although there is more leeway allowed for being technically proficient in your position.
All of this comes from the US attitude that leaders aren't born, they are made. Its a great theory, but fails horribly the first couple of years when we find ourselves in a shooting war.
The British and the Israelis have had (I don't know if its changed since I was in) a system that follows a modified version of the Peter Principal. Officers are allowed to find the level of command/responsibility they are a good match for and then spend the rest of their career there (with pay bumps for time in service and such).
The Brits have done that in the past for enlisted troops as well. A Corporal with 20 years of service is not unheard of. They won't be very good at planning a movement of a Rifle Company 100 klicks, but they'll be *very* good at getting his 4 - 8 soldiers over that distance.
My Marine friend retired at 20 as an E5, after 1) having never been an E6 (although he refused the promotion) and 2) never been busted a rank (almost unheard of in the Marines).
It used to be that at the magic '18 years' mark, they couldn't separate you for things like this; they had to let you stay in until you hit 20. (At 17 years, 11 months, however, you're SOL.) I know that applies to RIF (Reduction in Force, layoffs to you civvies out there), and I think it applies here as well, but I wouldn't swear to it. (My dad was RIF'ed at 17 1/2 years.)
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Date: 2008-10-21 05:04 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-10-21 05:49 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-10-21 05:53 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-10-21 06:31 am (UTC)Once you've missed two (or three) cycles, you have the option of retiring, or reverting to your highest enlisted rank. Depending on how close you are to your 'twenty' it might be worth it to revert and sweat out a couple of years, but it is NOT fun. There are slightly different rules for enlisted, but the general thrust is the same (except that, obviously, there is no option to revert to a lower rank and stay in - once an enlisted has missed the requisite promotions, they're just discharged).
Now, retirement is a different story. The standard is you can retire at twenty years of active duty and collect a pension or stay in, but once you reach thirty years, it requires special dispensation to stay in. General MacArthur got it. Colonel Smith won't. On occasion, officers with fewer years (15 is common) are given the option to retire with a pension, but this is the exception, rather than the rule.
While you didn't ask, I'll throw this in as well, your pension (either when you retire, or when you reach 65, if you didn't make your twenty) is based on your highest permanent rank AND the number of years your served. So the longer you stay in, the bigger the pension. On the other hand, our supposed Captain, who missed his promotion cycles and reverted to Staff Sgt, will automatically get promoted BACK to Capt when he retires (resulting in a situation where his/her pension is actually more than his/her current pay).
Hope this helped. (Neither vet nor military expert myself, but a lot of family in the service, and I've seen multiple people go through this process.)
Alex
no subject
Date: 2008-10-21 08:37 am (UTC)My Uncle's career stalled this way after making it to brigadier general in the air force. He had a divorce that got ugly and the wife circuit got word and that just about killed his chance at promotion. Officer wives have a great deal of influence over the career of higher ranking officers.
He was shuffled off three times to new command areas and in the end the base medical officer wrote a letter stating his health was too diminished to command. Which is a messy forced retirement.
no subject
Date: 2008-10-21 01:32 pm (UTC)Once you make major, there's another big hump between 'colonel' and 'general'. Promotion to general more or less requires connections, skill at office politics, etc. Simply being good at your job is no longer enough.
Alex
no subject
Date: 2008-10-21 01:47 pm (UTC)There are some people who are technical masters at their job, but aren't great leaders. In the US Army and US Marines, that's almost always a career killer.
(Great leader as defined by some vague and unknowable list of requirements in peace time. Even more vague in a shooting war)
We used to say
Date: 2008-10-21 01:54 pm (UTC)However 1). Availability of promotion may vary by era and personnel needs 2). As of the time I was in (20 years ago, between Vietnam & the War on Terror) you could not get to half-pay retirement (20 years) if you go in as a 2nd Lt, and never get promoted beyond Captain. Some Captains retired, but they had prior enlisted time. I met two Navy Lieutenants (O-3, like an AF Captain) who were involuntarilly separated without getting retirement for failure to be promoted.
A Major/O-4 can get all the way to 20 years without further promotion, but not to 30. I think a Lt. Col can get 30 years in.
no subject
Date: 2008-10-21 02:07 pm (UTC)Two flubs and you're either retired or required to separate. This could be kinda ugly if you've got 18 years in.
Now, an officer who is looking at a promotion to Major to Colonel, can attempt an early (or below-the-zone) promotion. Most of them don't do that unless they have a 100% lock on the requirements, (schooling, level/type of assignments, fitness reports) because if you *don't* get that promotion below the zone, it counts as one of your two strikes.
If you don't get promoted your first go around "in the zone", you slide into the "above the zone" the selection rate is *very* low (like 3%).
One of the real killers of this system is the fitness report. I've seen officers who just didn't get along with their superior officers get their careers hammered by the stroke of a pen. And I've seen dirt bags glow on paper.
NCOs staying in are a little different. There's a minimum rank that you have to be to be allowed to stay in for 20 years, that that is E6 (Staff Sergeant in the Army and Marines, Technical Sergeant in the Air Force and one of those frickin' Petty Officer ranks in the Navy/Coast Guard ((sorry, even after all this time being in the service and being interested in military, I still haven't figured out the naval ranks)). In theory, you could be promoted to E6 in the first eight years of your career and never get another promotion.
Once you hit E6, it becomes a case of how many years you can stay in before they muster you out. As an E6, you can stay for roughly 23 years.
NCOs have similar promotion requirements - schools, positions and fitness reports, although there is more leeway allowed for being technically proficient in your position.
All of this comes from the US attitude that leaders aren't born, they are made. Its a great theory, but fails horribly the first couple of years when we find ourselves in a shooting war.
The British and the Israelis have had (I don't know if its changed since I was in) a system that follows a modified version of the Peter Principal. Officers are allowed to find the level of command/responsibility they are a good match for and then spend the rest of their career there (with pay bumps for time in service and such).
The Brits have done that in the past for enlisted troops as well. A Corporal with 20 years of service is not unheard of. They won't be very good at planning a movement of a Rifle Company 100 klicks, but they'll be *very* good at getting his 4 - 8 soldiers over that distance.
no subject
Date: 2008-10-21 03:04 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-10-21 03:32 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-10-21 03:06 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-10-21 03:32 pm (UTC);)
no subject
Date: 2008-10-21 05:25 pm (UTC)Ditto and my thoughts before asking this were caused by this confusion.
I read "Retired as a Captain" and went Huh?
Doh!...should have read it as "retired at O-6."
no subject
Date: 2008-10-22 01:05 am (UTC)Alex